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Mack
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Post subject: What are you willing to Pay for Play?  Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:26 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 4:21 pm
Posts: 1032
Location: Canada
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Subscription based, online PC games are entering into the NA market more than ever now, with an already prominate place in oversea markets. I'm having a growing interest in researching the costs involved with developing an indie MMO. Someday I'd like to release a 'realistic work/cost' report needed to make a small indie MMO. I'll describe the choices here and you can pick what you support. Lower Quality: Many of the MMO imports, somewhat ugly, bit buggy Standard Quality: Higher class MMO imports, decent graphics High Quality: The $100 million dollar budget MMOs, decent/good graphics Lower quality, free to play, ad supportedLower quality MMO, it's free to play but it has ads where ever it can. On the loading screens, in the cities, and a dedicated ad bar at the top of the screen displaying ads. Little to no updates. Half decent content launch. Lower quality, free to play, micro transaction contentLower quality MMO, it's free to play but you only get the 'basic' content. You're limited by what you can do in the game unless you purchase the ability to increase your level cap, gain access to an area, purchase special weapons, special items, etc. Little to no updates. Half decent content launch. Standard quality, $5 per mo. (the Mini model)Standard quality MMO, you pay to play but there's no ads and no microtransactions. There's a few content updates over the year but nothing on a regular basis. There's a solid amount of content with launch. High quality, $40 every year (the Guild Wars model)Good graphics, large amount of content with every update, ingame events. Populated cities but not populated outer game world. High quality, $20 game, $15 per mo. (the WoW model)Good graphics, huge amount of content with the launch game, large content update 3-4 times a year, ingame events. Populated game world. While I've collected some information online about these results, I'd be interested in hearing what CDN members have to say on it. ArchAngel wrote: Is this for any Xrucifix project, or are you just scoping the field? I'm doing this primarily as an addition to the information I'm researching online, to help independent developers understand the costs and risks involved in even creating a small scale MMO (10,000 players and under). I have no plans to develop a MMO IP and XX has no plans on developing a MMO title. We're dedicating the majority of our efforts on completing Eternal War.
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leet hacker
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:22 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 11:22 pm
Posts: 947
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
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Even though I really like video games - they're my favorite activity - I don't think $15 a month is worth it for just one game. Xbox Live is different; I would pay $8 a month for that, because there's so many games to play online and stuff. I would really have to be obsessed with WoW to be willing to pay for it.
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Lava
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:23 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:54 pm
Posts: 1352
Location: California
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Will your MMO be called "Eternal Play: You'll never get off of this game"?
But yeah, this sounds like a good idea, even if you didn't make a MMO per say, it could help you understand the market a bit more.
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Zookey
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:32 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:57 pm
Posts: 1002
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In general, I support buying a game once and having microtransactions keep the business model going for online games--that doesn't seem to be an option---subscriptions to a game I already paid for is stupid!
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ArchAngel
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:36 pm |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:23 am
Posts: 1878
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I've voted for the Guild Wars model, because I really like it and would love to see more of it.
I like the Mini model, but then, I'd rather pay a little extra for a better quality game.
I've always wanted to make a micro transaction game. I've played a couple which are really fun.
I have played $15 a month for games before and it'd be worth it for a good game. I'd like it if the fee was a more reasonable $9.99. It seems less intimidating.
Is this for any Xrucifix project, or are you just scoping the field?
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Mack
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:39 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 4:21 pm
Posts: 1032
Location: Canada
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Lava wrote: Will your MMO be called "Eternal Play: You'll never get off of this game"?
But yeah, this sounds like a good idea, even if you didn't make a MMO per say, it could help you understand the market a bit more. Such a funny guy. Every noob game developer that hops online wants to make the epic MMO concept. I'd like to have something quick and brief showing them that they need to do 'this' in order to get it done. I spent about 6 months researching the costs involved in making a Guild Wars style MMO, but doing something like that would be highly unrealistic for an indie developer. I'm looking at what the costs would be involved for a team to develop something like Minions of Mirth or Love, small scale 10,000 player and less MMOs.
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Mack
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:42 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 4:21 pm
Posts: 1032
Location: Canada
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ArchAngel wrote: Is this for any Xrucifix project, or are you just scoping the field? I'm doing this primarily as an addition to the information I'm researching online, to help independent developers understand the costs and risks involved in even creating a small scale MMO (10,000 players and under). I have no plans to develop a MMO IP and XX has no plans on developing a MMO title. We're dedicating the majority of our efforts on completing Eternal War.
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ChickenSoup
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:02 pm |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 4:10 pm
Posts: 679
Location: 37
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Guild Wars isn't really 40 dollars a year, that's just if you choose to buy the other sections (Nightfall, etc.)
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kenman
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:31 pm |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 3:00 pm
Posts: 825
Location: Sunny Wisconsin
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Not sure if my vote should count as I have never partaken in games like this.. I would think you should be able to be easily ad supported with 500 users regularly using... but how many would consistently click away at advertisements...
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Mack
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:56 pm |
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Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 4:21 pm
Posts: 1032
Location: Canada
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kenman wrote: Not sure if my vote should count as I have never partaken in games like this... The question is more like, what would you be willing to Pay to Play. You don't need to be doing it currently. I'd like to get as many votes as possible to see what you guys think. ChickenSoup wrote: Guild Wars isn't really 40 dollars a year, that's just if you choose to buy the other sections (Nightfall, etc.) That's true, it is optional, but I'm considering it within the same universe as expansion characters and content can travel to the other areas and have an impact on the game world. The 'whole meal deal' is what I'm talking about.
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Lazarus
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:18 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 4:11 pm
Posts: 478
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Well, I refuse to pay monthly fees for a game. Too big of a drain on the pocketbook.
(Hey, it's easy to justify $40 for a good game. Paying $15 endlessly - not so much. You ain't playing that game constantly the whole month anyway.)
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Mene-Mene
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:22 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 7:10 am
Posts: 3384
Location: Indiana, United States
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I thought I say $40 a month, which I"m like, "No go bro!" but since its a year...
It REALLY depends on the quality of the game... If its really getting bigger, locations, cities that every month significant change is seeable and its fun, then I'd probably go with the WoW package just $9.99 a month. Somehow that's less intimidating. However if its 3-4 huge updates a year, I might not even be willing to pay $40 a year... But as for ad-supported, absolutely provided they aren't intrusive... If we're talking adds on items, if they're done well, I definetly wouldn't mind, but if you're videos that interrupt your gameplay, not so much.
However I really like MoM. Paying a one time fee of $40 is quite incredible.
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SSquared
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:00 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:14 am
Posts: 1579
Location: The Beautiful Pacific Northwest
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I don't play games enough to make a subscription fee worth it. I will just be throwing money away.
My choice, which is not up there, might be a mixture of a one-time game purchase and ads. $20-$30 for a game, with some unobtrusive ads, might get me interested if the game has at least your definition of Standard Quality. And low-cost ($15-$20) expansion packs every so often with updated content and stuff.
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Leathel
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:23 am |
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Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 10:02 am
Posts: 89
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For independents, it is definitely a tough call.
#1) They are usually brand new companies with a game that has never been heard of. Who is going pay $15/month for an unknown? Plus, most independents cannot match the games that cost $15/month.
#2) On the other hand, it is easy for an independent to use the MoM model and have the one time purchase of Premium and it is all you can eat after that. Granted this is great to draw people in, but there are many, many costs associated with running an MMO. Network bandwith and servers are the the biggest. If the somebody is trying to cover thsoe costs they have to rely on a constant flow of new Premium accounts being bought.
If I could figure out how to do it(technology wise), I would love to offer something like 40 hours free to play, but after that, you would have to pay to play. There are a few reasons for this.
a) Bandwidth and servers are not used up as bad, so don't need as much of a constant stream of money to cover an ever increasing growth.
b) Being a Christian game maker, I do not want Teens and parents spending all their time in a game. Their are higher priorities in life(family and homework). It also relieves the stress of pay per month where people feel they must play because they are paying for it.
A $40/year(or such) fee is something I had never thought about and will think more about. Although the players really like it, to me, the one time purchase will at some time catch up with a company. Servers will start lagging because the company cannot afford to purchase more bandwith or more servers.
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SSquared
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 10:57 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:14 am
Posts: 1579
Location: The Beautiful Pacific Northwest
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That's why I mentioned what I feel is a compromise between a customer's continual payment and the developer receiving some type of continual revenue stream (through ads).
I was almost about to put a check for the Guild Wars model. That is also a good compromise for me. One thing I don't like about the monthly subscription is you pay, even if you don't use it. If I don't plan on using it, I will need to stop payment. But if I want to pick things up again, I need to go and pay up again. The Guild Wars model lets me not play for a month or two and pick things back up later.
Just for reference, my daughter and I both play on MiniClip. I find many of the games to be good quality and free. Our whole family also plays on Webkinz. Though not strictly a subscription, you are required to buy the stuffed animals (and accessories) to play on-line. The animals average around $10-$12 apiece and give you 1-year of play. We only recently found out about the 1-year limit.
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Ross Leland
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 12:16 am |
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Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:41 pm
Posts: 81
Location: Hillsboro OR
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I predominantly play free games with micro-transaction content. Free because I am working on heading to college and becoming more and more independent and don't have cash flow to put out to a game currently.
Micro-transactions are cool when they are mainly aesthetic with some useful items, ie. 10% experience booster that lasts for an hour (costs around $3 for a pair) and scrolls to teleport you to various locations in game because it takes FOREVER to walk there (we don't have epic mounts in Dark Ages, you walk each and every tile x_x)
_________________ -Junior Programmer @ Heaven's Blessings Tiny Zoo "And he humbled you and let you hunger and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that he might make you know that man does not live by bread alone, but man lives by every word that comes from the mouth of the LORD." Deut 8:3 --- My Art Gallery (yes I do commissions)
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samw3
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:05 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:00 pm
Posts: 1394
Location: Toccoa, GA
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I'm so cheap.. I was vacillating today over whether or not to but a $5 virtual console game for my wii. I decided not to.  I definitely would not do a month-by-month thing. One time purchases for me if anything.
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David Lancaster
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:30 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:32 am
Posts: 492
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What game did you want to buy Sam? What games do you own via virtual console on Wii?
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samw3
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Post subject: Re: What are you willing to Pay for Play? Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:12 am |
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Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:00 pm
Posts: 1394
Location: Toccoa, GA
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It was Super Mario Brothers 3. And I currently own one title, River City Ransom.
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